A Vivid Case of Caudal Autonomy

[AndrewSeike]

A few weeks ago I had an incident with a young Northern initating caudal autonomy in front of my eyes. I have seen rhacodactylus ciliatus drop a tail right in front of me when it got spooked. It's quite disturbing to witness.

Well - this baby northern of mine got spooked. I didn't even touch it - just my shadow went over his head when suddenly a section of its tail began to move erratically while the rest of the tail remained relatively still. While I stared in deep horror as well as interest, the tail began to twist violently away like a maggot or exposed worm. The separation was extremely clean without blood although the end of the tail section was naturally red and moist.

I filmed the tail thrashing about but was unable to capture the entire disturbing occurence as it unravelled as it took me a few minutes to collect myself to do so.

Pictures forthcoming,

Andrew

[Hijinks]

That's so interesting, Andrew. Each day as I check the condition of Ping's weird tail injury, rubbing and poking at it, I am afraid it's going to drop off in my hands if he finally gets fed up with all the attention. I'm taking the fact that he hasn't dropped it as a sign that he's not afraid anymore.

I saw this same thing happen when I was like eight years old, trying to chase down a five lined skink in Tennessee. It was fascinating, and it certainly worked on this "predator."

[Zbiz]

Wooh thats interesting. Was the skink displaying any other defensive behavor like hissing and body curling? It kind sounds like the tail had a mind of its own lol.

[Zach]

Hey Andrew...

Do you mean the baby dropped its tail completely by itself without biting it or something else biting it?

[Jenn]

I've got to double that

[Fatal_S]

I do believe that is what he means. It's a defense mechanism. The wiggling tail left behind is usually enough to distract the predator and save the skinker. I can't imagine seeing that, I'd have a heart attack.

[thesilverbeast]

i wonder if theres a sence of pain attached to the process so they only drop it when its completely necessary. you would think with a defense like that they would want to save it until the critical time.

[Fatal_S]

I'm not positive, but I think they can actually do it more than once? What disturbs me about this defense is how it's been used by reptile dealers. By simply making a cut or 2 into the tail, especially at a young age, the dealer soon has a 2 or 3 tailed animal that can be sold as 'rare' and 'remarkable'. I've seen several of these, and it never fails to upset me.

[thesilverbeast]

oh really :S

that sounds awful.

[Zach]

I do believe that is what he means. It's a defense mechanism. The wiggling tail left behind is usually enough to distract the predator and save the skinker. I can't imagine seeing that, I'd have a heart attack.

Haha, you say that like I don't know anything about BTS autotomy! BTS can't "drop" their tails on command like many other lizards, but that's what it sounded like Andrew was saying. BTS tails can "pull" off or "break" off under great pressure or a bite and slightly cap off, but they don't grow back. You could not get a BTS tail to branch off three times, or even two times because the tail doesn't grow back at all, it just points off...and if you could do it, it would take extreme effort! Anyone who tried to do anything like that should be jailed.

Lizards who can drop their tails to diverge a predator -- their tails can regrow many times, and fully.

[Leigh]

,man that must of been gob smacking,was the tail caught in any way as you cast your shadow over the little guy,so inducing this behaviour? Has he always been a chicken and easily spooked? What proportion of the tail came off and do you expect it to regenerate Andrew?

[Richard.C]

that iss odd andrew,cant say ive ever seen or heard of a bluey dropping its tail by itself,be very interesting to see the pics and hear if anyone else has witnessed that,thanks for sharing andrew

[NomadOfTheHills]

BTS tails can "pull" off or "break" off under great pressure or a bite and slightly cap off, but they don't grow back. You could not get a BTS tail to branch off three times, or even two times because the tail doesn't grow back at all, it just points off...and if you could do it, it would take extreme effort! Anyone who tried to do anything like that should be jailed.

Gigas tails grow back, I have witnessed this.

I believe however, the bible states that scincoides do not.

[SailleSkinklover]

Hey Andrew, Did you get pics of the portion of tail that fell off? I'm curious to see how much of the tail was "released".
Also, how stresed does this Bluey tend to get? I always thought Northerns were pretty mellow?

[AndrewSeike]

Wow - TONS OF QUESTIONS!

I love it!

First off - Fatal_S - you're correct, it was just a shadow that initiated the tail being released.

[AndrewSeike]

Hey Andrew, Did you get pics of the portion of tail that fell off? I'm curious to see how much of the tail was "released".
Also, how stresed does this Bluey tend to get? I always thought Northerns were pretty mellow?

Hi SailleSkinklover!

Oh yeah Northerns and Easterns - most skinks in general take some major and I mean major threat to elicit this kind of response. IE - grab and yank to another conspecific biting the tail. Even then they tend to not drop their tails.

They are usually really great so this is why I was so disturbed to see this happen right before my eyes. I handle the guy now - he's doing great. No problems.

I do have pictures which I have to transfer over. It's a great educational moment for me as I have seen skinks with many tails missing in varying lengths mostly (I am assuming) from some sort of physical trauma. I'm sorry its taking so long but I''ve been working long long hours and then going straight to work with the reptiles often past midnight. I have to be up at 6am for work. I don't mean to complain or sound winny. =)

At least now we can see where a skink would drop it to distract a predator before contact is even made.

Andrew

[AndrewSeike]

That's so interesting, Andrew. Each day as I check the condition of Ping's weird tail injury, rubbing and poking at it, I am afraid it's going to drop off in my hands if he finally gets fed up with all the attention. I'm taking the fact that he hasn't dropped it as a sign that he's not afraid anymore.

I saw this same thing happen when I was like eight years old, trying to chase down a five lined skink in Tennessee. It was fascinating, and it certainly worked on this "predator."

Hi Amanda!

Awesome pic! Thanks for that.

It definitely takes a great effort on your part to get the animal to drop its tail unlike a crested gecko which does spook easily. Northerns and Easterns are pretty good. Sure they spook but they are reluctant to drop their tails from all my years of dealing with babies.

PS: we also have some 5 lined skinks here too in certain areas. I just saw a few! I wanted to take photos but I didn't have a camera. I did capture a fence lizard by hand though. I let the baby go soon afterward at the exact same spot of the capture - but not after I petted it a dozen or so times ever so gently on its cute little head. It was completely relaxed after a few seconds and walked up my hands gently.

Andrew

[AndrewSeike]

i wonder if theres a sence of pain attached to the process so they only drop it when its completely necessary. you would think with a defense like that they would want to save it until the critical time.

Hi SB,

I really can't speak for the skink but there appears to no real pain and no blood. The joint and muscles connections in the tail are made to detach from each other smoothly. You can even see the V shaped wings of the muscles in the thrashing tail where there is a very clean detachment. My actual knowledge in the internal structures of the tail is limited but my experience with other lizards that are capable of such defense mechanisms show this to be true.

Take for instance your common leopard gecko. They can detach their tails in several places. I have just witness a detachment so low down the tail that only half the of huge bulbous end is missing while in other cases the entire tail was dropped.

Great question - I just hope all these animals feel a lot less pain than us. I tend to believe so as many reptiles will simply sit on the old fashioned hot rocks and burn themselves through their scales into their flesh without moving.

Andrew

[AndrewSeike]

:shock: ,man that must of been gob smacking,was the tail caught in any way as you cast your shadow over the little guy,so inducing this behaviour? Has he always been a chicken and easily spooked? What proportion of the tail came off and do you expect it to regenerate Andrew?

Hi Leigh!

Yeah can you believe it? I didn't even touch it. The shadow came over and it thrashed in the corner a bit and then the tail started to twist away. I just stared in equal amounts of horror and fascination.

The tail will regenerate but will look quite ugly. The colors will be blended as if scrambled with a wisk. Nothing beats that nicely striped tail but the little guy will be alright. I have several skinks with regen tails from various situations - all learning experiences believe me! Thanks for the questions Leigh!

Andrew

[AndrewSeike]

Wooh thats interesting. Was the skink displaying any other defensive behavor like hissing and body curling? It kind sounds like the tail had a mind of its own lol.

I know tell me about it.

Thanks to everyone - Zach (squared), Richard and the rest of you for the questions.

I'll try my best to get the pictures uploaded today/tomorrow.

Andrew